★Discussion of Human Values

I’m hoping some of you will contribute thoughts about Human Values. This topic has been stirred up in my heart and mind and I would appreciate some honest discussion on this topic. It is important that each of us get a handle on our values and prioritize them. Many of us have conflicting values and aren’t even aware of it. We can be working against ourselves without even knowing. My understanding is that getting our personal values sorted can be very freeing and is something I want to work on, but it can be a fairly onerous task. I started looking up lists of human values and the lists are VERY long. I suspect they could be categorized a bit that would make the task easier, but I’m just beginning the process. Please share your thoughts.

In response to themadcookieman’s post:
Value lists are great, MCM. Why don’t you post what you have and keep adding to them like you did with the positive adjectives?

I feel the greatest value or trait we can pass on to out future generations (some of us in our generation also need to sort it out within themselves) is of respect for all other fellow beings and for all types of jobs. The presenr generation only seems to think of everything in terms of money. There is no value or respect for relations/age/humanity….We need to understand that we are beings from the same higher soul and need equal love n respect. There is no color/caste/status/position…. when it comes to meeting our final fate. We all leave behind evrything that is material, and take with us the lessons and good/bad karma accumulated.

Let us strive to bring about this awareness of giving importance to the virtues and the inner soul….lets leave behind these false beleifs.

In response to SONIA’s post:

Excellently said Sonia. That is exactly how I feel. The golden rule works so well because we need to treat others the way we want to be treated. One of my principals is to “pay it forward” when someone does something good for you, you should in turn do the same for someone else. Usually tell them to please do the same this way the positive energy keeps on going.

Peace,
Mary

no matter what color, religion, or job you hold in this world you have a responsability to teach the next generation human values. to love our fellow man. to respect one another. to understand that god created all of us in his image and weshare the same world. they are not hard things to understand, but people make things harder than it needs to be.

Here’s something I read in a book by Dalai Llama, I think. If you could trade your body for a new one, you’d still be you (only healthier and prettier, etc!). If you could trade your mind for a smarter one, you’d still be you (only smart as Einstein!) So there must be something else. To me, that’s the human value we all have.

Here is a link to an article on Steve Pavlina’s site.
Living Your Values

I also got this from Steve Pavlina’s site.
——————————————————-
List of Values
The following list of values will help you develop a clearer sense of what’s most important to you in life, as explained in the article Living Your Values. Simply print out this page, mark the values which most resonate with you, and then sort your list in order of priority. As you scan the values list below, you may find that while most values have little or no significance to you (and some may even seem negative to you), there are those values that just jump out and call to you, and you feel, “Yes, this value is part of me.” This values list is merely a guide. It is lengthy and contains many synonyms but is certainly not exhaustive, so feel free to add unlisted values to your own list as well.

1.Abundance
2.Acceptance
3.Accessibility
4.Accomplishment
5.Accuracy
6.Achievement
7.Acknowledgement
8.Activeness
9.Adaptability
10.Adoration
11.Adroitness
12.Adventure
13.Affection
14.Affluence
15.Aggressiveness
16.Agility
17.Alertness
18.Altruism
19.Ambition
20.Amusement
21.Anticipation
22.Appreciation
23.Approachability
24.Articulacy
25.Assertiveness
26.Assurance
27.Attentiveness
28.Attractiveness
29.Audacity
30.Availability
31.Awareness
32.Awe
33.Balance
34.Beauty
35.Being the best
36.Belonging
37.Benevolence
38.Bliss
39.Boldness
40.Bravery
41.Brilliance
42.Buoyancy
43.Calmness
44.Camaraderie
45.Candor
46.Capability
47.Care
48.Carefulness
49.Celebrity
50.Certainty
51.Challenge
52.Charity
53.Charm
54.Chastity
55.Cheerfulness
56.Clarity
57.Cleanliness
58.Clear-mindedness
59.Cleverness
60.Closeness
61.Comfort
62.Commitment
63.Compassion
64.Completion
65.Composure
66.Concentration
67.Confidence
68.Conformity
69.Congruency
70.Connection
71.Consciousness
72.Consistency
73.Contentment
74.Continuity
75.Contribution
76.Control
77.Conviction
78.Conviviality
79.Coolness
80.Cooperation
81.Cordiality
82.Correctness
83.Courage
84.Courtesy
85.Craftiness
86.Creativity
87.Credibility
88.Cunning
89.Curiosity
90.Daring
91.Decisiveness
92.Decorum
93.Deference
94.Delight
95.Dependability
96.Depth
97.Desire
98.Determination
99.Devotion
100.Devoutness
101.Dexterity
102.Dignity
103.Diligence
104.Direction
105.Directness
106.Discipline
107.Discovery
108.Discretion
109.Diversity
110.Dominance
111.Dreaming
112.Drive
113.Duty
114.Dynamism
115.Eagerness
116.Economy
117.Ecstasy
118.Education
119.Effectiveness
120.Efficiency
121.Elation
122.Elegance
123.Empathy
124.Encouragement
125.Endurance
126.Energy
127.Enjoyment
128.Entertainment
129.Enthusiasm
130.Excellence
131.Excitement
132.Exhilaration
133.Expectancy
134.Expediency
135.Experience
136.Expertise
137.Exploration
138.Expressiveness
139.Extravagance
140.Extroversion
141.Exuberance
142.Fairness
143.Faith
144.Fame
145.Family
146.Fascination
147.Fashion
148.Fearlessness
149.Ferocity
150.Fidelity
151.Fierceness
152.Financial independence
153.Firmness
154.Fitness
155.Flexibility
156.Flow
157.Fluency
158.Focus
159.Fortitude
160.Frankness
161.Freedom
162.Friendliness
163.Frugality
164.Fun
165.Gallantry
166.Generosity
167.Gentility
168.Giving
169.Grace
170.Gratitude
171.Gregariousness
172.Growth
173.Guidance
174.Happiness
175.Harmony
176.Health
177.Heart
178.Helpfulness
179.Heroism
180.Holiness
181.Honesty
182.Honor
183.Hopefulness
184.Hospitality
185.Humility
186.Humor
187.Hygiene
188.Imagination
189.Impact
190.Impartiality
191.Independence
192.Industry
193.Ingenuity
194.Inquisitiveness
195.Insightfulness
196.Inspiration
197.Integrity
198.Intelligence
199.Intensity
200.Intimacy
201.Intrepidness
202.Introversion
203.Intuition
204.Intuitiveness
205.Inventiveness
206.Investing
207.Joy
208.Judiciousness
209.Justice
210.Keenness
211.Kindness
212.Knowledge
213.Leadership
214.Learning
215.Liberation
216.Liberty
217.Liveliness
218.Logic
219.Longevity
220.Love
221.Loyalty
222.Majesty
223.Making a difference
224.Mastery
225.Maturity
226.Meekness
227.Mellowness
228.Meticulousness
229.Mindfulness
230.Modesty
231.Motivation
232.Mysteriousness
233.Neatness
234.Nerve
235.Obedience
236.Open-mindedness
237.Openness
238.Optimism
239.Order
240.Organization
241.Originality
242.Outlandishness
243.Outrageousness
244.Passion
245.Peace
246.Perceptiveness
247.Perfection
248.Perkiness
249.Perseverance
250.Persistence
251.Persuasiveness
252.Philanthropy
253.Piety
254.Playfulness
255.Pleasantness
256.Pleasure
257.Poise
258.Polish
259.Popularity
260.Potency
261.Power
262.Practicality
263.Pragmatism
264.Precision
265.Preparedness
266.Presence
267.Privacy
268.Proactivity
269.Professionalism
270.Prosperity
271.Prudence
272.Punctuality
273.Purity
274.Realism
275.Reason
276.Reasonableness
277.Recognition
278.Recreation
279.Refinement
280.Reflection
281.Relaxation
282.Reliability
283.Religiousness
284.Resilience
285.Resolution
286.Resolve
287.Resourcefulness
288.Respect
289.Rest
290.Restraint
291.Reverence
292.Richness
293.Rigor
294.Sacredness
295.Sacrifice
296.Sagacity
297.Saintliness
298.Sanguinity
299.Satisfaction
300.Security
301.Self-control
302.Selflessness
303.Self-reliance
304.Sensitivity
305.Sensuality
306.Serenity
307.Service
308.Sexuality
309.Sharing
310.Shrewdness
311.Significance
312.Silence
313.Silliness
314.Simplicity
315.Sincerity
316.Skillfulness
317.Solidarity
318.Solitude
319.Soundness
320.Speed
321.Spirit
322.Spirituality
323.Spontaneity
324.Spunk
325.Stability
326.Stealth
327.Stillness
328.Strength
329.Structure
330.Success
331.Support
332.Supremacy
333.Surprise
334.Sympathy
335.Synergy
336.Teamwork
337.Temperance
338.Thankfulness
339.Thoroughness
340.Thoughtfulness
341.Thrift
342.Tidiness
343.Timeliness
344.Traditionalism
345.Tranquility
346.Transcendence
347.Trust
348.Trustworthiness
349.Truth
350.Understanding
351.Unflappability
352.Uniqueness
353.Unity
354.Usefulness
355.Utility
356.Valor
357.Variety
358.Victory
359.Vigor
360.Virtue
361.Vision
362.Vitality
363.Vivacity
364.Warmth
365.Watchfulness
366.Wealth
367.Willfulness
368.Willingness
369.Winning
370.Wisdom
371.Wittiness
372.Wonder
373.Youthfulness
374.Zeal

In response to themadcookieman’s post:
Great!

I feel like a kid in a candy store with this topic. There is great power in this, I know it. There are more exhaustive lists out there, but this should give us a pretty good starting point. It seems to me that we should consider identifying our values in different areas of our lives such as career, spirituality, family and so on so that we can be aware of areas of inner or subconscious conflicts we have. If we put a little effort into bring our values to the surface – our conscious mind – we will have a much better understanding not only of ourselves, but of others as well. I think conflicting values has a great deal to do with the political divisions and turmoil within our countries.

I feel sure there must be some valuable info already out there and I’m looking, but if you find something please post it. Surely someone out there has figured out ways to categorize human values in some useful ways to help us sort this stuff out. Seems to me that our values could be clarified for each of us in different ways such as “personal values”, “physical values”, “social values”, and so on – or some other way, as I mentioned earlier, such as “family”, “career”, “spiritual” and so on.

Please comment more on this topic, I am fascinated by it. I’m more and more convinced that identifying our values is a very, very, very valuable step in getting what we want because it will help us to live our lives “on purpose”.

Do you find your values differ by area in your life? Shouldn’t the values in your life be the same?

I’m not sure yet, ‘cause I haven’t done the work to find out. However, I have been doing a little reading and I know for certain that many of us are walking around with conflicting values. Most of us are probably not even aware of the conflicts, yet those pesky little conflicts are holding us back. We often work against ourselves without even being aware of it. Bringing your values to the surface and really examining them will make us aware of stumbling blocks. Prioritizing our values is important. They can change over time and vary in different situations. I think we can even “choose” values to develope. We can also, by becoming more aware of how we evaluate things through our values, “re-frame” situations and our reactions to events in ways that will benefit us. I’ll have to study this more before I can explain it better. I’ll try to find an example to explain what I mean by that.

When you have a family of your own or teach others, you only want to reflect long lasting positive values. We all need to be reflectful, appreciative, loving, and faithful in all we do. The best thing in life is time to love the wholesome things, throughout our lifespan.

other links gone…this one remains(:

great

Quoted excerpt from 2007 Conscious Life Skills
If you choose to build your list of values based directly on your life experience, think back to a time when life was rewarding and satisfying. What were you doing? Who was present? What qualities or values were you demonstrating?

Whether you identify your personal values from a list of human values, or from reflection upon your life experience, the questions below can help in ‘feeling’ how important a value is to you.

· Is this something that’s important to you? · Do you feel good about this being important to you? · Would you feel good if people you respect knew that this was important to you? · Have you ever done anything that indicates that this is important to you? · Is this something you would stand by even if others made fun of you for it? · Does this fit in with your vision of who you are?

Integrating your values in your everyday life

Knowing and prioritizing your values in everyday life can help you significantly in three ways.

Firstly, knowing and prioritizing your values can help you prioritize how you spend your time and energy right here, right now. For example, if you receive an offer of promotion, you’ll likely take up the offer, if success is high on your list of values. If family life is high on your list of values, and the promotion meant longer hours away from the family, then you might choose not to take the promotion.

Secondly, knowing and prioritizing your values can help bring clarity to important decision making. When you have an important decision to make, you can consult your prioritized list of values and ask: What would a person with these values choose to do in this situation?

Thirdly, knowing and prioritizing your values can help resolve tension between choosing values in an apparently conflicting situation. Let’s look at a common situation. You feel quite comfortable when you tell a white lie to someone because you don’t want to hurt their feelings yet you know it’s not generally all right to tell a lie. Is there a conflict in values here? If so, what higher priority value would you employ in this situation – honesty or kindness? Do you vary the application of values in this situation depending on the company?

Evolving your values

Our personal values can change and shift in priority as our life experiences bring new information and deepening insights to light. When this happens, you’ll experience a sense of disharmony between your inner and outer lives. This requires you readjust and reprioritize your working list of personal values. Then you adapt your outer lifestyle, so you are living in harmony with what’s important to you now.

For example, as you grow older, health may become more of a priority value compared to when you were younger. In your outer lifestyle, you then make time for exercise as part of your routine, and choose healthier foods to eat.

Over time, personal values usually become more universal in scope, because they are the avenue through which we find the answers on how to live life with meaning. We begin to see patterns of experience and insight in our lives, which converge with patterns of experience and insight in the lives of others. We find out we are connected in relationship with each other, irrespective of what age and nationality we are. For example, love is recognized both as a personal and a universal value.

Valuing yourself

Whatever personal values you identify and prioritize are going to be right for you. They are not necessarily right for anyone else. Your personal code of values tells you more about who you truly are, and the way you think feel and do. By taking the time to know and feel your personal code of values, you are valuing who you are and how you express yourself. Valuing yourself is an integral part of consciously practising self honour – the act of loving and respecting yourself.

More (incoherent) thoughts.

You know the story of the guy who makes it all the way to the top of the ladder only to discover that after the long climb he finds out that the ladder was on the wrong wall, well THAT to me is why this is so important.

It has become clear to me how vitally important it is to identify and rank our values when we are trying to figure out what we want.

Our “purpose” and our “values” need to be in synch. If what you truly want is in line with your values and your purpose, and you are actively living according to your values, then you will not only get what you want, but you will LOVE the journey that gets you what you want. If you value something it is much easier to be enthusiastic about it. It is easier to have “faith” that you will get it, and when you have “faith” that you will get something you KNOW you will get it. When you KNOW you will get something, there are all sorts of factors involed that assure that you will get it. Not only will your conscious self confidently go for what it wants, all the powers of your sub-conscious self will go to work for you as well.

Consider how two “good” values to have can be in conflict. If you value “adventure” and “security”, then you can be in conflict. How about “marriage” and “freedom”? See what I mean?

Well maybe, and I say maybe I am living my values.

While I don’t always get what I need in the work world according to my values, I still live by them. I’m not sure if you know what I’m saying. Tell me if you do.

Makes perfect sense Laurie

In response to “themadcookieman’s post“Consider how two “good” values to have can be in conflict. If you value “adventure” and “security”, then you can be in conflict. How about “marriage” and “freedom”? See what I mean?”

Dear, cookie monster
As I’ve grown up I do beleive that you can have plenty of freedom while being dedicativly married to your spouse. Same goes for sound adventure and a good sense of security.

I looked up ability and saw this cute cartoon

you won’t be able to read the words.

It says:

Do you want to elaborate on the part “and then everything went wrong” ?

It reminds me how we are all trying to be our best selves in situations where we still are learning and making mistakes. Our values can still be strong even when they don’t shine(:

Well, I’m “fleshing” this out in this forum so indulge me a little – I don’t think I’m gonna’ be able to take the by-pass on this one, I’m gonna’ have to go through town and hit all the lights.

I hate to use the word “always”, but all of our actions “as humans” are actions that either move us toward pleasure or away from pain. If we smoke, for example, it is because there is something we “value” about smoking. We may know it’s bad for us, but for some reason we still value it. So much so that we keep on doing it. To stop smoking we have to learn to value “NOT” smoking more than we value “Smoking”. Once we do that, we will stop. Most of the time our “values” are working on a subconscious level. By bringing them to the surface we can evaluate them and use them productively. We can consciously “choose” what we value in any given situation. We can always find something “good” to focus on. I haven’t read “Man’s Search for Meaning”, (I am always on the lookout for a copy at the thrift store), but I believe that is one of the ideas in the book. He survived the concentration camp because of what he chose to focus on. Our values determine what we focus on. You can change the level of importance of values by changing the way you represent them to your brain. (Or your ego.)

Here is something from Tony Robbins “Unlimited Power”.
…Suppose a person’s number one value (in a relationship) is attraction, number two is honest communication, number three is creativity, and number four is respect. There are two approaches to creating a feeling of satisfaction within the same relationship. One would be to make respect the number one value and make attraction number four. Thereby you could take an individual who is no longer attracted to his partner and make that feeling less important than his respect for her. As long as he felt he respected her, he would feel his highest need was being fulfilled. A simpler and less radical approach would be to determine his evidence prodecure for finding someone attractive. What does he have to see, hear, feel? Then, either change that attraction strategy to have him share with his partner what he needs to have that value fulfilled.

We LOOK for evidence to support our values. If we believe life sucks, then we look for evidence to support this view and we find it. If we think life is great then we find evidence to support our belief. We learned our values through our life experience. We can learn different values if we choose. I’m not making this up, I believe it’s true. We can apply this to whatever area of life we choose.

Your absolutely right. Another thing I have learned is that you have to hate the opposite of what value you want. For instance you have to hate cigarette’s in order to conquer what you want.

In response to bbirishbug’s post:

That was just an example of a “possible” conflict. That might not be the best example, but value conflicts do exist and they are fairly common.

Great post Laurie, and you too bbirishbug. Keep it up! We will have to have a private convo about “progressive” ideology though.

Here is a link to a web-based tool for helping you discover your values Tool

I am BEGGING you guys to read this article. I am so glad I found it.
Living Your Values

In response to themadcookieman’s post:
While the info is familiar, it is still wonderful and reinforcement of it is always a good thing!

I went to a retreat with a job years ago, and we worked on values. I always enjoy putting mine in order to see where I’m at today.

Though, in this article in part 2, I really enjoyed the part about putting goals in order to best understand my values.

I enjoy multi-valuing. I have health as #1, and close 2nd’s are many of the things listed in the article. If I’m not careful fun will be at the bottom of my list,, because so much comes before that. But if I multi-value I can make being healthy fun etc….

In response to themadcookieman’s post:

Hi MCM what belongs to us flows freely. When we have to work TOO HARD most of the time it isn’t meant for us. When we are going in the right direction and we are working towards our goal and everything starts to come together it is definitely yours. I learned that in Silva Mind Control classes. It has been true for me.

Peace,
Mary

Hey, i listend to “the shirt” that was awsome and funky! in regards to the human values. i believe that each of our human values comes from within. i mean to each is there own individual self. i believe that i am a kind person because i am kind to myself. i am loving because i have accepted myself just as i am and love myself just as i am. i believe that i have learned to forgive others easily because i know that i have been forgiven, i am positive that i have been forgiven for things that i am not aware of. once i began to quit judging myself i stopped judging others. there was a time where i was very angry and started to become a bitter person that lead to depression and other wild thoughts and action took over. i knew that wasnt the real me. my mind and heart were not matching up. i had to learn to let things go and once i was able to learn not to expect the impossible i began to heal. my mind and heart are together again and the outcome from my decissions have been awsome. i have attracted better people in my life and the outcomes have been things that i never dreamed of. i know that God healed and restored all and i have been given 10 fold. i dont mean material things because i am good in my clunker and small apartment.

Here are my favorite values that would make the world a better place to live http://img33.imageshack.us/img33/9429/fruitage2.jpg

WOW fascinating thread!

It’s sometimes dangerous to categorize things, as soon as you do that you are limiting yourself and risk becoming even more confused.

Of course you can’t really discuss these things without categorizing, but I’m going to do my best to be as accurate as possible without being limiting.

So… This moment, right now, is the current manifestation of infinite causality. What this means is that there’s an infinite number of causes that have lead to this moment being the way it is. This is true of every moment that has ever been and will be of every single moment in the future. (Well, strictly speaking there is only one moment, but you get me)

Some of the causes that have made this moment what it is have shaped the way through which you perceive everything else about the moment. The more we adhere to these these rules and values that we consider our own, the less we see our circumstances for what they are.

Each circumstance, being made up of an infinite number of causes, is complex enough as it is. Adding something extra, like for example your values, is complicating the situation even more.

What’s more, you are actually deluding yourself! Jeff quoted Tony Robbins and said “We LOOK for evidence to support our values” and this does tend to be the case. What this means though is that in having these values in the first place, you’re going about looking for things that support our values and avoiding things that don’t. At the very least we’re interpreting things to suit ourselves rather than seeing the world for what it really is.

Of course it’s impossible to not do this. But despite the impossibility of it, that’s the ideal I’m currently working towards.

Anyway, values is a funny word. I’ve thought a lot about it since I wrote that article on Rules vs Values. My current way of thinking differs (perhaps dramatically) to what I wrote in that article. At the moment, it seems to me that strictly adhering to your rules and values will cause you to not act in accordance with reality, and I like to try and keep it real :)

All of our interaction with the world is filtered through our interpretation of reality, so to me it makes sense to be aware of our values and to use them as guideposts. Most of the time our values are at work on a subconscious level, but bringing them to the surface from time to time seems like a very practical exercise. I like the information that suggests that we can “choose” the values we want to focus on and incorporate more into our thinking, without a doubt our values change over time anyway, often without our even really being aware of it. So far I’ve found two sources, Robbins and Pavlina, that say that we definitely have the ability to “choose” values, so I believe there is truth to this. Pavlina suggests reviewing our values every few months – he suggests that we prioritize our values and re-prioritize our values as our goals change. One “value” might be more conducive to bringing about particular goal than another “value”.

In response to themadcookieman’s post:

So true that “all of our interaction with the world is filtered through our interpretation of reality”.

That’s why it is important to stay focused on the best of the best thinking, and making the complex more simple when possible. You seem like you’re a bottom-up thinker too. We learn so much that way.

And I agree that “it makes sense to be aware of our values and to use them as guideposts”.

Being aware of why you want what you want is important.
For example, I’ve been focusing on age lately. There is a sense of urgency
for various areas of life for myself and my hubby to be more structured in terms of now and for “later”.

So we chat as often as possible to know what we want, why we want it and what interests us for now and that infamous “long run”. Bringing values to the surface is vital as you say.

We’ve noticed as we get older what we need to do toward our basics and our creative desires have surfaced more. This in turn brings a sense of urgency to our conversations which in turn creates our values “in our face more often”.

I strongly agree reviewing our values regularly. And when involved with others, values within goals should be looked at as indiv. and as a couple. And yes, the the prioritizing re-prioritizing is essential.

I am getting confused !!! There is so much in so many threads!

Here we are talking about values— whatever is our true self comes to us effortlessly — true—- then what does our shadow do?It also comes to us in the negative form, effortlessly.
Can I take my negative qualities as my values from previous births/experiences? Why should I not work hard to get rid of them and adopt the good values/virtues. I am here to move forward and how many of us have the time to come to terms with the stark reality of souls, rebirths, karma, past lives, moving ahead…..
When we talk of human values should we not discuss the negative ones too so that acceptance is easier. Sometimes we are surrounded by so much positivity that our grey areas become neglected and we are not able to focus on their elimination. without recognition we can never eleminate.

I am sorry for the off track thought process but it was bothering me.

In response to Lee Nutter’s post:
Isn’t reality what we interpret it to be? What is my reality is different than what is your. Something like glass half full/half empty.
I agree having a specific opinion on a subject might hinder you from seeing all aspects of it. On the other hand is that a value? Or just an opinion?

I still am chewing on this topic. I already have a few “opinions” :-) on it. I believe that we all have values, things that are important to us, and things that are less important. The ranking changes in the course of the years. I agree that the contradictory values, if you are conscious of both of them, can actually be coexitent and not at all contradictory. As in the marriage and freedom. If you are conscious of both, you might redefine what freedom means to you.

Re: political issues – (I might be looking at a different situation than you are) – not sure if they are always based on different values, I see that they are more due to lack of respect and acceptance of eachother.
This might also be an opinion of mine, since these are values which were not in BBs list for a better world.

MCM, this looks great, but I can’t pull it up completely with dial up. Wish I could

Also..Anthony Robbins mentions the following values:
Try putting these in order and see what everyone comes up with

Health/Vitality
Love/Warmth
Intelligence
Cheerfulness
Honesty
Passion
Gratefulness
Fun/Happiness
Making a Difference
Learning/Growing
Achieving
Being the Best
Investing
Contribution
Creativity

Great Book to help you do something significant with values is by Anthony Robbins- Awaken the Giant Within.

I recommend the book highly!

On the last page of his chapter on values he says:
“Is it possible to have values and not feel you are living them? You can have a great system of values that gives your life a magnificent direction but still feel unhappy, unless you understand the power of rules.

At the end of the next chapter which pertains to this, he says ask yourself these questions:
1. What does it take for you to feel successful
2. What does it take for you to feel loved by those important to you (paraphrased)
3. What does it take for you to feel confident?
4.What does it take for you feel excellent in any part of your life?

Strongly recommend the book!

I have the audiobook of Awaken the Giant Within, I will listen to it again and try to pay attention to the stuff on values. Part of the reason I became so interested recently is from something I found in ANOTHER Robbins book, Unlimited Power. I found a copy for fifty cents in a thrift store. It’s actually a signed copy. Anyway, you know how you can read something and understand it, but you read it again later and it really clicks. Well, that’s what happened, the stuff on values really clicked as being very significant stuff.

I started whittling down my own list from the really long list I posted above, but I still think this stuff could really be whittled down into “categories” that would make the process easier. The other list you posted laurie- does first things first~‘s post: looks useful.

In response to themadcookieman’s post:
One of the things Anthony Robbins says is we have to see what rules define us that’s why I included the questions.

I was listening to Brian Tracy’s “The Science of Self Confidence” and he stresses the importance of values on the tape. I guess I’m really focused on that concept right now so it keeps jumping out at me.

You know what is interesting to me about Robbins is that he was working with these ideas when he was so young as compared to me. When I was his age I was really struggling with wanting to believe in Christianity, and running into the walls of “religion”. I really, really struggled with what I considered to be so much hypocracy. I remember back in those days finding Shakti Gawain’s “Creative Visualization”. The book made a lot of sense to me. I still read stuff from The Bible and much of is seems to be at odds with what I believe, but I more or less write off these passages as being either misinterpretations of what Christ was saying or literal errors in translation. The books of the Bible were “selected” by a men, there are other gospels that weren’t included, but for one reason or another didn’t make the cut. Also, the Gospels were written long after Christ had died, not during his lifetime. The events were recorded from the memories of different men. Most people don’t know that there was even a Gospel of Mary. The texts for many of the “other” gospels still exist.

I don’t know why I shared all of that stuff! Just get carried away sometimes.

We should definitely be aware of our values, but we shouldn’t hang onto them. It’s this hanging on to them that is the problem. As you said, they can be great guide posts, but my current way of thinking says that’s about all they should be.

Sonia, we should definitely look at the areas where we need work. These are the best guide posts. Focusing on areas where you’re already proficient is nothing more than rubbing your own ego

I think it was Dogen Zenji who said “If you fall on the ground, stand up by the ground” :)

Aftab, I used to talk about your reality vs other people’s realities, but I suppose I’ve done a complete 180 on the topic. These days I’m of the opinion that there is only one reality, this is the truth.

Of course there is your interpretation of reality, and my interpretation of reality, but these are both just delusions. The more we believe that these interpretations are actualities, the more deluded we become.

My opinion these days is that it’s this emphasis on your reality vs my reality that is the root cause of so many of our problems. We push so hard to get what we want and to avoid what we don’t want and get so wrapped up on what’s important in our lives that we totally forget that a part of something much bigger than ourselves.

It causes us to become dispassionate and the more we stick to this way of thinking, the more out of of touch we get with the fact that there are other people in this world that are equally deserving of happiness.

Ironically, it’s this way of thinking that is the root cause of the majority of our unhappiness too. When our reality has little ‘victories’ it strengthens our resolve to get our way and we get sucked into thinking that we can have it all.

An extreme example is one that Laurie has already mentioned, that’s aging. If your reality was really real, then why didn’t you just remain 25 or 31 or however old you were when you considered yourself in your prime?

The fact of the matter is that you will get old, and one day, you will die. So will I, so will everyone in the entire world. On the surface this sounds incredibly depressing, but when you embrace this fact, then you’ll get a clearer understanding of your true priorities and find out what’s really important to you.

Note that this understanding is useful if your 25 of 75. Your death is a certainty, but your time of death is incredibly uncertain. You could get hit by a bus tomorrow.

I’ve used this extreme example to prove a point. If your reality really was real, then how come you can’t stop things like this from happening just by willing it?

Btw, I’m not saying I’ve fully integrated these ideals. I’ll be working on them forever. I’ve still got an incredibly strong sense of self that causes me problems every single day. I get upset when things don’t go my way and I still value myself above others. In this way and many others I’m incredibly selfish and I’ll be working on changing that until the day I die.

The way I see it though, this is the only way forward.

I agree that in “reality” there is only one truth, and we all interpret this truth through our ego. It’s when we become still, when we are “being” that we are closest to our true selves. I wonder if we were in a state of total stillness if we would lose complete awareness of the physic world or would we, could we, still be aware of our physical surroundings. Could such a state of absolute stillness even be brought about while we occupy this body? We are the awareness of our ego, could we, as humans completely transcend our ego and still be aware of our physical environment? I guess, at least right now I think, we HAVE to have an ego to interact with “the world”. I see the point of what you are saying about focusing on areas in which you are already proficient as stroking our ego’s, but when we are interacting with the world it makes sense to me to use your strengths. To me it seems natural because your strengths are a part of you, part of what makes you unique and special. If we consider that there is one reality, we are a part of that reality. In our body we have a heart, it is part of the whole of who we are and it has a special function or “talent”, it’s doing what it is good at, what comes naturally to it. Now our true selves are, right now, using this body. We have a heart which has a job to do and it does that specialized job very well, we don’t even have to consciously think about it, but we also have another very specialized tool, our mind. The mind has a lot of options, it is a very versatile tool we can use to bring about what we want in our lives. We can use it to work on our weaknesses, to “improve” those areas, but we can also use it to take advantage of our talents – the things that come naturally to each of us.
What we want for ourselves is part of the truth, the whole, just as what we want for others in a brotherly, loving sense. Persuing what we want and being true to ourselves is being true to others. As we grow, what we want changes naturally, as we grow we begin to care more for others. Wanting more for others as we grow is, in fact, being true to ourselves.

Wow, I was off the site for moments, and phenomenal discussion has taken off in big ways. You can’t leave this site for a minute(: I’ll be back. Keep it up though. You guys are great!

“I agree that in ‘reality’ there is only one truth, and we all interpret this truth through our ego. It’s when we become still, when we are ‘being’ that we are closest to our true selves”

Totally agree. This is one of the many reasons why meditation is such a powerful thing.

“I wonder if we were in a state of total stillness if we would lose complete awareness of the physic world or would we, could we, still be aware of our physical surroundings. Could such a state of absolute stillness even be brought about while we occupy this body?”

In Zen Buddhism, they talk about the dropping off of body and mind. It’s when they become one that they disappear and we become truly aware.

It’s not that you lose awareness of the physical world, it’s that, perhaps for the first time ever, you are completely aware of the physical world. You are completely aware of yourself, but yourself as a part of this ‘organism’ that is the universe.

Some people say that we are all just the universe, experiencing itself in different ways. During meditation you sometimes get glimpses of this understanding and begin to feel that it really is that way.

“I guess, at least right now I think, we HAVE to have an ego to interact with ‘the world’. I see the point of what you are saying about focusing on areas in which you are already proficient as stroking our ego’s, but when we are interacting with the world it makes sense to me to use your strengths.”

Also agree. We’ve spent our entire lives building this thing we call ‘me’ or our ‘self’ up, and ripping it down quickly just isn’t productive. Even if it was possible, you would probably end up in some psychiatric ward before you figured out what was going on.

It’s a slow and steady process, slowly but surely shifting your focus away from this ‘self’ and it’s unreasonable and uncompromising needs and wants and moving towards something so much more than that.

Your strengths are a part of this. In some ways it’s through these strengths that you can make the most progress.

“To me it seems natural because your strengths are a part of you, part of what makes you unique and special. If we consider that there is one reality, we are a part of that reality. In our body we have a heart, it is part of the whole of who we are and it has a special function or ‘talent’, it’s doing what it is good at, what comes naturally to it. Now our true selves are, right now, using this body. We have a heart which has a job to do and it does that specialized job very well, we don’t even have to consciously think about it, but we also have another very specialized tool, our mind. The mind has a lot of options, it is a very versatile tool we can use to bring about what we want in our lives. We can use it to work on our weaknesses, to “improve” those areas, but we can also use it to take advantage of our talents – the things that come naturally to each of us.”

Also totally agree. You shouldn’t hate yourself for being talented. This body of ours is the agent through which we can do something positive and productive. It is our only way of creating causes that have effects. Our goal though should be to do what we can to make sure that the effects of our actions are positive ones.

It’s interesting what you say about the heart being a part of the whole that is our body. It’s a very apt analogy and one that can help take us away from our self centered way of thinking.

If we are a part of a whole, then being selfish is one sure way to fuck the ‘whole’ up, whatever that ‘whole’ is (god, the universe, one, truth, whatever)

It’s like the heart saying ‘no blood for you!’ or the lungs saying ‘no oxygen for you!’ or something. If any one of our organs doesn’t pull it’s weight, the whole body suffers. Note: I know nothing about biology so this analogy could probably be better expressed but you get my drift :)

“What we want for ourselves is part of the truth, the whole, just as what we want for others in a brotherly, loving sense. Persuing what we want and being true to ourselves is being true to others.”

This is the only part I disagree with slightly. More often than not, our wants are so uncompromising. You want something, period. Some people will do almost anything in their power to get what they want, even if it involves stepping over others in the process.

You may not think you’re like this but observe your behavior, you’ll probably find that in subtle ways, this is how you act. It might be a ‘innocent’ as not doing w task for x person because you really ‘need’ (want) to get y task done before tomorrow so you can do z activity. (does that make sense?)

I know that I’m definitely guilty of this. Not answering phone calls because I’m ‘busy’, spending money when I probably shouldn’t, not thinking of Mel because I’m too busy thinking about myself. I’ve got a million justifications for it, but they all boil down to me wanting this or that, or me wanting things to be this way when they are that way.

The thing is though you’ll never not have needs and wants. To do something to better the world we live in you need to survive. To survive you need to eat, sleep, work and defecate. Not much you can do about that.

But you’ll also have other wants that are outside of these essentials. It’s these things you can do something about.

The trick here is not necessarily to not want them in the first place. We’re probably hard wired to want and even if we aren’t it’s deeply embedded habitual behavior. But what we should do is learn to control these desires, and to not be attached to either the desire, or the object of desire.

Seeing things for what they are helps with that (we are back to realities) If I want a BMW and you want a Mercedes, both our wants are uncompromising. If you gave me a Mercedes I would be disappointed it wasn’t a BMW. But the Mercedes is your object of desire.

See, in reality, the object isn’t what causes the desire. It’s you. If it really was the object then everybody would want the Mercedes and BMW would be out of business.

This is a simplified example and probably full of holes but you get the picture. You can control your desires, you can learn to want without attachment. This is what you need to do to get over your self centered view of the world.

Of course once again I’m light years from achieving this goal. But it’s something that I’ll be working towards for the rest of my days because as best I can tell, it’s the only way forward.

“As we grow, what we want changes naturally”

I don’t know about wanting changes, but being more accepting of changes, definitely.

“as we grow we begin to care more for others. Wanting more for others as we grow is, in fact, being true to ourselves.”

Totally agree! Love it :)

In response to Lee Nutter’s post:
I am truly lovin’ these posts!

Lee I don’t want to over-simplify. I fear I might miss your point. Though are you referring to a level of detachment with what “is” and acceptance for what “is”?

“What we want for ourselves is part of the truth, the whole, just as what we want for others in a brotherly, loving sense. Persuing what we want and being true to ourselves is being true to others.”

This is the only part I disagree with slightly. More often than not, our wants are so uncompromising. You want something, period. Some people will do almost anything in their power to get what they want, even if it involves stepping over others in the process.
————-
I’m not sure what to say about this one. A self-centered, selfish piece of crap type of person, let’s take a crooked politician for example wants what he wants and is willing to lie, cheat and steal to get what he wants. He might have deluded himself into thinking he is persuing what he really wants, but he is not. He has a very confused thought process that, to him, justifies his actions. A kind hearted person helping the homeless or whatever is also persuing what he wants, but assuming his motives are “noble” then he is indeed being true to himself. His thinking and ego are not confused, at least they are much “closer” to being true to themselves.

I don’t know if I explained that very well, I’m just thinking on paper.

It all comes back to intention.

If someone is helping someone because they want to, and it’s actually useful to the people they are helping this is great. But they are still putting their own wants above those of others. Once they’ve ‘scratched their itch’ so to speak, they’ll help others no more.

Politicians do this all the time, they say they are helping people by doing x and y but that isn’t really what the people want. To stay on topic I won’t mention any specific issues, but I’m sure any given newspaper will have plenty of examples.

If someone helping the homeless is helping someone else get what they want, not attempting to satisfy their own desires, then it’s genuine. They are putting someone else above themselves.

Imagine if politicians did that? They weren’t concerned with their own status within their party, getting re-elected or promoted or ‘helping people’ only when it suits them (ie, they want to because they are getting something out of it as well) the world would be a far better place.

I guess it comes down to the selfless ideal here. The ‘I’ll scratch your back if you scratch mine’ game is childish. You shouldn’t just help someone because you ‘want’ to or because you’ll get something back in return. You should help someone to help someone.

Once again, it’s ironic that helping someone just to help them is incredibly rewarding and forgetting, even momentarily, about your own concerns is liberating and the cause of a great deal of happiness and satisfaction.

This is hard for me to articulate, maybe I need to think about it some more. I’m thinking out loud here too.

Laurie, I’ll get onto attachment in a bit, it’s a big topic :)

In response to Lee Nutter’s post:
Motives right?
One needs to ask themselves if they are helping someone for their own need to help, or because it’s truly useful to another.

I think often, people don’t care if it’s true altruism, if it’s truly helping another.

Am I getting your meaning yet?

Non-attachment is a very often misunderstood concept.

It doesn’t mean walking around disassociated from the world, not caring and being completely dispassionate. It’s the exact opposite.

Attachment or clinging is the cause of the majority of our suffering. It’s related to the way we go about seeking pleasure and avoiding pain. Paul Haller talks about “too much / not enough” type habitual behavior.

It’s attachment to the way we think things should be, which comes about because of our own sense of self importance. It’s too hot, it’s too cold, I need more work, I need less hours at work, I need more time to myself, I want more dinner, I want less sauce with that. You get my drift :)

Non-attachment is about not attaching to your ideals like this. Just let go, stop trying to change things and make them perfect. Accept things the way they are you’ll be much happier, much more satisfied. This is especially good advice for over anxious people like myself.

Our society is so goal oriented. Silly people like myself have helped perpetuate this way of thinking. The problem with it is that for many people, myself included, take their goal far too seriously. Only when you’ve done x will your life be complete. Only when you’ve achieved y will you feel good about yourself. And on, and on and on.

This way of thinking is wrong because by the time you’ve achieved x, you’re looking towards y and you never stop to appreciate what is. You’re never satisfied because you’re always attempting to scratch an itch and of course the itch is a moving target so even if you do manage to get at it, it isn’t long before it starts up again and you’re off, living (in your head) for a time that might never arrive.

I suppose goals aren’t so much the problem, it’s your attachment to the ideal they represent. Goals are important, but only because they give you some direction so you’re not wandering around aimlessly. I guess the best way to use goals is to set one, and then work on developing habits that will get you there.

Every day, practice these habits and before you know it you’ll be at your goal, but you would have lived every day completely.

There’s a story about a Zen master that was giving his students a lesson in archery. The target was at the edge of a cliff, high above the ocean. He stood in front of his students and carefully pulled the bow back. All the students were tense with anticipation as the master took aim. Finally the master released the arrow and it went sailing over the target and into the ocean below. BULLS EYE! He yelled, as his students stood there dumbfounded.

So true, Grasshopper!
We are always trying to get pleasure or avoid pain. To loosly quote the Tao, “Life is hard”. The idea is that once we accept that, then what is “hard” becomes less so. It’s about acceptance of what is. When we are in nature, in the forrest or on a mountainside it is easy to become peaceful and at ease. There is growth and decay all mixed together, there is no struggle. There is a natural order to it. Focus on a tree or a flower, to quote Chevy Chase, see the ball, be the ball…

You know what is so great about this discussion? It’s that it made me smile on the inside. I sound like a pseudo-intellectual wanna’ be monk. I’m laughing at myself. In a good way! Let’s get a couple of loincloths, Lee, and head into the desert to live off of locusts!

For me the greatest value is the “path of least resistance” sometime ago I got up nerve to ask someone for help. They never responded. I could have thought all kinds of negative things about that person. Yet I learned that everyone has the right to do what they want they are not here to save me. It doesn’t make them heatless or mean. They can still be good people.

When my mind started with the negative chatter I asked myself, “how important is it to here from this person?” Do they owe me anything? How will this affect my health or life? Only to find out not at all. It was my own stinking thinking that brought up those negative thoughts. The true answer came to me suddenly because I gave up fighting. I took the path of least resistance. It caused me to have a revelation that opened my heart and mind. We cause our own misery no one else does it to us. Like Eleanor Roosevelt said, “No one can make you feel bad without your permission.”

When we realise this we can be free. It is not so easy to find this path yet something within me started to make me change the way I think. At some point we get to such a hard place in life and are so tired of feeling bad that we give up fighting and low and behold there is the answer. Stop tormenting yourself and let go. The path of least resistance.

Peace,
Mary

In response to godscreation’s post:
Wow Mary! Thats sooooo what I needed to hear. So very true. I think I need to write a little quote of yours out on my desk:

We cause our own misery no one else does it to us. Like Eleanor Roosevelt said, “No one can make you feel bad without your permission.”

I also like:
Stop tormenting yourself and let go!! The path of least resistance….

You are in a great place at the moment I can tell. Thanks for sharing this. It has really shed light on a small but significant ‘blockage’ to my happiness. I am so glad I visited this thread first thing. I look forward to exercising this value in my day.

One of my greatest values I lean toward (though not a perfectionist with), is doing things right when they need to be done.

When I say not being a perfectionist, if I have to do something that is needed between the 8th and the 15th->the 15th still works if my time got used up in ways I didn’t plan for.

I like to confront me and my life head on. I like giving that infamous closure. I get creative with it(:

In response to SONIA’s post:
I guess it depends on how you define a value. Name some negative values.

A negative form, is it truly the value?

Can’t we accept all parts of ourselves because it currently is, and focus on the positive values to create more of that?

If procrastination is part of you, yes it needs to be accepted, so you can love all and accept all parts of what you “are”. Isn’t what we are who we say we are, and sometimes haven’t risen to the occasion yet.

I accept my behaviors, my drives, my motives… Though, I don’t want them to lead me around to places I don’t want to go.

For me to be the best I can be, I accept me, and converse w/me and take me where I want to go.

My values are my areas that I hold dear to me, and I would “fight” for those things.

Help me understand what you’re saying. It sounds very interesting.

In response to Lee Nutter’s post:
I’m wondering if your “non-attachment” is my term detachment.

My understanding of detachment allows me to step back, be disconnected from ownership, though connected to thought more logically to own or not own, if ownership is even something that can be mine.

You can love someone and detach from them to better love them. You can never own them. You can try and experience them:
who they are
who they are to you
who you hope they’ll be with you on occasions

though to glom on to them, would attempt to claim something (someone) that truly isn’t yours.

They are theirs.
They are God’s.
They share your life.

Is this connected to what you’re saying?

From Wikipedia:

A personal and cultural value is a relative ethic value, an assumption upon which implementation can be extrapolated. A value system is a set of consistent values and measures. A principle value is a foundation upon which other values and measures of integrity are based. Values are considered subjective, vary across people and cultures and are in many ways aligned with belief and belief systems. Types of values include ethical/moral values, doctrinal/ideological (religious, political) values, social values, and aesthetic values. It is debated whether some values are intrinsic.

Contents [hide]
1 Personal values
2 Cultural values
3 See also
4 References
5 External links

[edit] Personal values
Personal values developed very early in life may be resistant to change. They may be derived from those of particular groups or systems, such as culture, religion, and political party. However, personal values are not universal; one’s family, nation, generation and historical environment help determine one’s personal values. “We carry with us values that influence our thoughts, feelings, and actions.”¹ This is not to say that the value concepts themselves are not universal, merely that each individual possess a unique conception of them i.e. a personal knowledge of the appropriate values for their own genes, feelings and experience. “Researches on values has found that adolescents who are involved in groups that connect them to others in school, their communities, or religious institutions report higher levels of social trust, altruism, commitments to the common good of people, and endorsements of the rights of immigrants for full inclusion in society. Adolescents who were uninvolved in such groups were more likely to endorse self-interest and materialistic values.Belief”¹

I’m glad you posted that bbirishbug. It’s touching on something that I think is worthwhile – I think it would be useful to see values listed according to some sort of “grouping” or “labeling” if you will. The post mentions “primary” values, can we find a list of what is generally considered the “primary” values and so on?

Here is another link.
Human Values as Common Ideals and Practical Rules of Behavior

In a book by Clifford Sharp, “The Origin and Evolution of Human Values” he gives this useful problematising description:

“Human Values are the ‘habits of thought’ each of us acquires as we mature so that we can assess and deal with ‘ethical’
problems (where ‘ethical’ relates to the fundamental question of how we should live). Should we aim at happiness or knowledge,
at virtue or the creation of beautiful objects? If we choose happiness, will it be our own or will it make proper allowance for
the happiness of others? And what of the more particular questions that face us? Is it right to be dishonest in a good cause? Can we justify living in opulence while elsewhere in the world people are starving? What are our obligations to the other creatures with whom we share this planet, and to the generations of humans who will come after us? What do we regard as a ‘good’ quality of life? For us? For others?”

I see some are having trouble knowing what their values are, when it’s so simple if you live a simplified life and do a lot of reflection. Values can be close relationships, pets, financial security anything! My values don’t change much because they’ve always ment so much to me. I know this sounds corny but i’ve seen people identify their values with stickers!
(i’ve done this) It’s a blast

In response to bbirishbug’s post:
I could be wrong, but I don’t believe most members don’t know what a value is. I believe it’s more about what their true values are at this time of their life.

During some parts of your life, you might have been doing what others want you to do.
Ex. while you’re still in school in your earlier years-“doing certain things for the folks”

When children are small you might be more focused on family than when they leave the house.

If you are newly single, can focus on yourself more.
If you have a new spouse or child-*focusing on family*.
If you’ve been married a long time and have lots of personal goals-maybe a value could be balance between self and family.
If you’re understanding that you can’t have more in your life without being in peak form->Health can be a newer value for you.

When financial security is strained you might be more geared to some specifics toward financial security (more education, *career advancement or changes, 2nd jobs).

If you don’t need to work anymore, maybe you are focused more on volunteerism, or creativity (arts).

Examining where you are today, and asking yourself important questions is vital toward understanding values. That’s the reason MCM’s extensive list was great. A list like that can trigger things for individuals that want to clarify what today means to them.
I’m in agreement the basics of who we are often doesn’t change, if you know yourself.
Examples:
Honesty
Fairness

That’s my thought, anyway(:

Your so right :) I guess values have a lot to do with your big picture in life. How can one achieve their goals with conflicting values? That’s often what happens with celebs, they have initial values and achievement goals but then they mess up their life because they are too involved with money and hollywood. That’s one reason why I never wanted to become famous, I knew that i’d lose focus if I did. You need will and self control.

Good manners are never out of fashion.

My values of respect for others, truthfulness and committment to the present will be valid in all the times. Though I know there are situations when people want to redicule you for being correct or respectful, but in our heart of hearts we all know what is right.